OK... so now I´ve looked at the newcharacter.ini file, and changed the name of the initial starting system. I´ve built a system in FL Explorer, sitting all by itself... with one planet, one docking ring, and a sun. When I tried to load up FL Server, though, it recorded the following errors in the console log: E:FLScratchSourceCommonGoodList.cpp(450) : *** ERROR: Cannot open goods file ..dataequipmentengine_good.ini E:FLScratchSourceCommonLoadout.cpp(179) : *** ERROR: unable to open Loadout file ..datashipsloadouts.ini E:FLScratchSourceCommonDataConfig.cpp(142) : *** WARNING: LOADOUTS file ´..datashipsloadouts.ini´ contains no new definitions. E:FLScratchSourceCommonBaseData.cpp(226) : *** ERROR: Invalid ini block in file ..dataUniverseSystemsBR07BasesBR07_01_Base.ini Now... I haven´t messed with engine_good whatsoever... nor loadouts.ini... and wtf is this about an INI block problem? BR07_01_Base.ini is, obviously, the new base in my system... fresh out of FL Explorer, so assuming that it didn´t do anything wrong (which I don´t know)... why am I getting this error message right out of the gate? I thought I had this problem solved... grumble...
Posts by Argh
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Fjord, thanks for your detailed and helpful reply. The information on Fuses looks most interesting, indeed. If I used custom models, though... would I need to somehow have a SUR file, in order to obtain the results I wanted- i.e., hits on specific parts would result in specific damage? Or would it be enough for each "part" (in this case, the "pilot" ) to "steal" a SUR reference from something with similar dimensions? As for the "random factor" added to shooting... there´s script available that has to do with rotating planets and other objects... I´ve seen this in mod XML files. Is it possible to apply such things to the player´s ship somehow? I´ve never seen any ships with *any* moving parts, other than guns, so I´m assuming this is a "no", and that the guns cannot be scripted in any way... but it´s worth pursuing, maybe. Obviously, there are animation calls being made to open the "hatch" when cargo is ejected, so I´m wondering if it might be possible, say... to move the firepoints for a given gun around a wee bit very rapidly, using a script, so that while the shots would all converge at the "max range" point (which seems to be calculated based on the highest-velocity gun, based on some cursory tests), they would arive there on vectors that differed significantly enough to "feel" randomized, unless you happened to be flying at the point near convergence (in which case, you´d be having a really crappy day, hehe). I´ve already completed some experiments where I have guns that are ever-so-slightly slower/faster than one another (in my case, I used thousandth-of-a-second increments), which produces a much more "machinegun-like" array of bullets, because after the first shot, the increments keep cycling and putting the "first gun", "second gun" etc. further and further apart from one another, timewise. As I already intend to have a system where players buy multiple guns which are identical in performance but are bought to increase the ammo load (i.e., Machinegun A can have 500 rounds and doesn´t share ammo with Machinegun B... just like RL), this "time-synching" of the guns is fairly close to the effect I want anyhow... I´d just like to make it even more random, so that I can have machineguns with somewhat-realistic velocities but not so pinpoint-accurate that all players have to do is hover and fire off a burst at anybody who shows up. Maybe... hmmmmmmm.... I could make machineguns that have a much longer effective range than people´s sight radii... that might solve this problem... I could just give them a long flighttime... then they wouldn´t converge nearly as much. Gonna have to test this assumption, of course... I´ll let you know the results <img src=smilies/icon_smile.gif width=15 height=15 border=0 align=middle> As for the physics model... I´m going to need to test some of their assumptions pretty carefully. The sections where they´re talking about turn radii and stuff make perfect sense... what does *not* seem intuitive (at least, until I try some experiments) is their assertions about the relationships between thrust and mass. If I followed their arguments correctly (which is in some doubt, of course), then without the drag constant, there would be no upper bounds on speed (i.e., everything would act like zero-gravity spaceflight with thrust and mass, as opposed to the magical world of FL where everything has a maximum velocity created by drag)... so playing with drag, thrust and mass very carefully *should* theoretically result in getting the performance I´d like to see from my "aircraft". They´d have a very low drag, but probably the engines´ drag would eventually cancel out the thrust at whatever seems "reasonably realistic" for the scales of the mod, so that the "aircraft" would be forced into somewhat-realistic banking turns, and would be put into positions where they would run into the "ground" even if users killed their engines right away, unlike the way it is in FL where doing so means that the drag almost instantly kills the velocity. In an almost-unrelated question... has anybody tried putting a *negative* number into thrust, to see whether it can kill speed, as opposed to increasing it? I´ll have to try that... maybe instead of "emergency power"... I could have "air brakes"... people would trade initial velocity for lower velocities, once they´d finished "bouncing" an opponant... just like real fighter pilots used their flaps to increase drag (and also increase their ability to turn quickly)... just some random thinking there, and it probably won´t work in FL´s engine anyhow... it probably doesn´t recognize negative floats. Edited by - Argh on 10/5/2004 8:12:50 PM
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I´ve already seen that there are a number of issues- for one thing, building a single system with the required types of objects is not as easy as I´d hoped. And modding the ships in such a wholesale way is also going to cause issues... not to mention having to edit the entire single-player game, to eliminate crashes when FL looks for things that aren´t there <img src=smilies/icon_smile_wink.gif width=15 height=15 border=0 align=middle>
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Hi there, Reactor people. I´m Argh, and I´m a modeler/animator/texture guy, among other things, and I am always interested in modding games that I enjoy. I think Freelancer´s single-player experience was one of the best I´ve had in a long time, but the multiplayer... is... underwhelming. Why? 1. The sheer size of the original game´s setting isn´t conducive to a multiplayer experience. Players who wander far afield can literally spend hours without seeing another human being. 2. Since many players are basically powergaming, like in MUDS, players who want a really spiffy ship are basically doing FedEx freighter runs, again for hours, before they can afford a trip to find a ship worth playing against another player with. This isn´t fun... it´s the single-player game without a plot. 3. There isn´t any real reason to play cooperatively with others, other than the sad fact that if you don´t hang out with others, you´re basically playing by yourself in a universe that doesn´t offer much besides automated quests that aren´t terrifically interesting. 4. Current add-ons, while adding some new ships and a few changes to gameplay and looks, aren´t really fixing any of these fundamental problems- i.e., taking a really nice single-player epic and turning it into a cool multiplayer experience. This is just my opinion, of course, but I think that some clever gameplay additions and alterations could really make a big difference. I have played a lot of the mods available, and they´ve been disappointing. I know that the authors have the best intentions, but they just don´t have the level of quality I´d like to see, and many of them... make the problems worse, not better, by just super-powering everything. ************************************************************************************************ I have a lot of experience as a modder and 3D artist. I have made some multiplayer maps for Half Life and Counter-Strike, have built and coded custom models for Total Annihilation, was one of the lead beta-testers for Runesword II, etc., etc., etc. So please hear me out before you flame- I´m only a newbie to this MB
I think that a good multiplayer mod for Freelancer would include the following things: 1. A limited scope of play. I.E., instead of dozens of stellars, make the game built around a single stellar, with no jump points whatsoever, and pre-plan the planets and locations very carefully to create a situation where a war between players makes sense. 2. Careful alteration of existing gameplay, to create a small, balanced set of weapons suitable for ship vs. ship combat. Like all decent FPS games, I think that a good multiplayer Freelancer mod would feature quick, deadly combat, and would utilize the existing game code to better effect. Here are a few example ideas: A. There´s no reason why guns shouldn´t have to buy ammunition. Simply mod some missile files so they behave like guns, and set the max-ammo to whatever seems balanced. Then mod the ships so that they can´t carry "missiles" in certain spots... only "guns" and "lasers". B. Damage should be carefully balanced around a paper-rock-scissors system. The game, as delivered by Microsoft, really didn´t have this- they tried, but there just wasn´t any point in mounting some weapons, like plasma guns, or buying certain ships. I think in multiplayer, what little PC vs. PC combat I´ve seen really highlights this issue. Freelancer´s original game design doesn´t work very well in multiplayer- everybody ends up with the same ships and the same guns and the same shields... or they´re a poor guy who gets stomped. C. Skill should matter a LOT more than money. Even the best ships should be relatively easy to destroy, if flown by a novice pilot. At the very top level of play, an experienced and skillful player should buy their ship based on their mission, not because they´re clever enough to find the "hidden starbase" where super-ships can be bought that make everything else useless <img src=smilies/icon_smile_wink.gif width=15 height=15 border=0 align=middle> D. Thrusters should be balanced for specific ships, instead of for a class of ships- they shouldn´t even be allowed for other ships. Thrusters should be part of the balancing of the game specifically for multiplayer- see example ships below. This would allow relative thruster speed and burn time to be a big balancing factor. I´d do the same with cruise engines, to give players a distinct feel in each ship. E. Instead of trade, I´d center the game around piracy and war. The game should be about testing your skills against others, not the computer or boring fedex questing. So, from these general ideas, I will move to some specific concepts about what types of gameplay I´d like. Here´ s sketch of the mod, weapon designs and ship concepts. This is all pretty vague, of course- this is a design document, not the design. But it´s a start. THE GAMEPLAY The game should include the following features, subject to playtesting: 1. A one-solar "universe" that takes 20 minutes to cross at the lowest designed cruise speed. 2. The solar system should be divided into two areas by a thick asteroid belt. Let´s call them the "A" side and "B" side. The asteroid belt can be crossed the good ol´ fashioned way, by risking your ship, or you can try the two space lanes that exist on either side of the stellar. 3. New players are spawned into the no-man´s land of the asteroid belt, where several neutral stations are tucked away. 4. Players can join the "A" side or "B" side in a very simple manner: they can take a mission at either side´s Homeworld that irrevocably changes what side they are on. Until players pick a side, both A and B sides are neutral. Players who´ve just started out, however, should quickly notice that the neutral systems don´t sell any ships or guns worth buying... they must pick a side to survive. 5. To prevent llamas from camping on the newbie spawning grounds... once you have taken a "pick a side" mission, the neutral ships that swarm around the neutral bases will attack all players who´ve chosen a team. The neutral ships should be deadly enough that llamas just get killed, fast <img src=smilies/icon_smile_wink.gif width=15 height=15 border=0 align=middle> 6. You cannot buy any vessels, equipment or guns from the A or B Homeworlds until you have picked a side. This way, it´s obvious to other players which side you´re on- you can´t join B and then go get an A team ship later on, to fool people with. That said, I´d include several vessels specifically for covert ops... more further down. 7. Weapons should be divided into classes, just like the game is now, but balance should be done completely differently than in the single-player game: A. There should be 4 main classes of gun: Railgun (BFG, extreme range, power and accuracy, but only fires once every 5 seconds or so with no radius, so skill is a must), Machine Cannon (ammo-using guns, decent accuracy, strong damage and high ROF, but ammo is not unlimited), Lasers (energy-using, medium damage and medium ROF, unlimited ammo so long as energy is available), and Pom-Poms (low ROF, burst radius, low damage but very dangerous when there are a lot of them firing at something) B. There should be 3 main classes of missile: Torpedoes (pretty much as they are, but damage should be re-balanced, see farther down), Guided Rockets (flight time/range of about 10 seconds, high damage and manueverability, high suseptibility to counter-measures), and Swarm Missiles (high ROF, low guidance, low range, medium damage). C. Finally, there need to be cap-ship guns that actually work like the real deal. Basically, these should be fast-moving, extreme range guns that are capable of actually denting another capship, and kill regular ships DEAD. Their ROF should be quite low, for obvious balance reasons- the current examples of capships I´ve seen in several mods... arrrrgh... are waaaaaay overpowered. That´s it for basic weapon balance. Here are some specific numbers: The "Average Joe" ships on the A and B side should have 1000 shield and 1000 armor. Here are damage ratings... for missiles, lasers and machine cannons, in that order. Missiles: Extreme: 5000 points of energy and armor. You are DEAD, if you are not a capship. High: 1000 points of energy and armor. You have lost your shields, or you´re dead. Medium: 300 points of armor. You can take 7 hits before being destroyed. Lasers: Extreme: 500 armor, 350 shields. It takes 5 hits to kill. High: 350 armor, 200 shields. 8 hits. Medium: 200 armor, 50 shields. 25 hits. Better have a lot of these firing at once. Low: 50 armor, 50 shields. 40 hits. Please tell me that you aren´t joking... Machine Cannons: Extreme: 2000 armor, 4000 shields. Bye bye. Your little fighter just got hit by a capship cannon that fires shells the size of a Buick. High: 1000 armor, 1000 shields. 2 hit kill. This would be the equivalent of the the AK in CS. Medium: 500 armor, 500 shields. 4 hit kill. This is the equivalent of the M4A1. Low: 200 armor, 200 shields. 10 hit kill. This is the MP5. Weapons should be balanced mainly by altering their ROF, ammo, and by limiting certain classes, such as torpedoes and railguns, to specific ships with special uses. Ship Designs: Here are a few ideas. Again, this is all pretty rough, but the idea is to create balance, not let the gamer who´s been on for 40 hours straight but who has no skills defeat superior players who´ve been on for 1. Scout/Raider: The Scout/Raider would be able to mount 1 Medium and 2 Low damage lasers or machine cannons. Its principal advantage would be that, while it has very little armor, it would have the best cruise engines in the game, a 10-second high-powered thruster, and a very manueverable flight style. The Scout has about 500/500 protection. Average Joe: This is the best all-around design, with very few flaws or weaknesses. On the other hand, it´s not very strong in any particular area, either. It should have 1000/1000 protection, and mount 1 Medium and 2 Low damage lasers/cannons, plus a Medium missile launcher. It should have good manueverability, 8-second high-powered thruster, and a better-than-average cruise speed. In combat, it should trump Scouts. Sniper: The sniper is a specialist craft, designed around a BFG. It should work with a team-mate or two for best effect. Protection is slightly more than Average Joe, at 1500/1500. It is armed with one Heavy laser/cannon, and one Light. It has a slower cruise speed than Average Joe, a 5-second high-powered thruster, and average cruise speed. With a Heavy gun, though, it can go toe-to-toe with Average Joes and win, unless the pilot doesn´t aim very well. Scouts should trump this ship, because their manueverability and speed are great enough to make them hard to hit with a slow-firing BFG. Torpedo Bomber: This fighter is designed to deliver anti-capship torpedoes, and survive a fair amount of hostile fire. Like the sniper, it requires teamwork to use correctly. Protection is 2000/2000. Armament is two Light laser/cannon, 1 Extreme missile launcher. It has a slow cruise speed, but it has a 15-second thruster with medium levels of thrust, which means that while it can´t match other fighters for top speed, it can almost certainly get into and out of a torpedo run. Its manueverability is mediocre, but not incredibly bad- it´s not a fighter, but it´s not totally helpless. Pom-Pom Platform: The Pom-Pom is a slow, well-armored craft that fills a strategic role between capships and fighters. It´s not powerful enough to go toe-to-toe with even a lowly Frigate, but it´s invaluable for protecting your capships from Torpedo Bombers. Protection is 5000/5000. Armament is 6 Pom-Poms in turrets, which do Low Cannon damage and have an area effect. It has a cruise speed that´s between a capship and a torpedo bomber, and a 20-second thruster at low levels of thrust- basically a way to quickly change heading, but it can´t dodge missiles. Its manueverability is pretty bad, but not quite capship bad. CAPSHIPS Capships in this game design play a very special role. They are very heavy warships, with armor and shields that fighters cannot beat with ordinary weapons. On the other hand, their cruise speeds, normal and thruster speeds are quite low, and their most powerful weapons are mainly designed to destroy other Capships. In a multiplayer mod, players who can afford a Capship will mainly use it to blockade the other side´s Homeworlds with. Capships are vulnerable to Torpedo Bombers, and can eventually be defeated by Snipers, if there are enough of them. Since both fighter types would (ideally) be unable to deal with normal fighters all of the time, players will either work in teams... or get defeated piecemeal. Capships work best with a team that includes a Scout or two, a Pom-Pom to defend them from fighters, and a few Average Joes for all-around backup. A force of 6 players working together in this way can defeat large numbers of players who try to act like Rambo and charge them, so this will encourage teamwork. Frigate: This is the lowest-level capship. It is designed to kill both fighters and Pom-Poms, but will not last long against a Cruiser or Battleship. Protection is 10,000/10,000. Speed, thrust and cruise are low, manueverability is fairly low. Frigate captains will frequently just use Turret Mode in combat, and not manuever once engaged. Armament is 2 Pom-Pom turrets, 2 Medium missile launchers, and one Extreme missile launcher. Cruiser: This is the first Capship armed with Main Guns. It is too big to use in an Asteroid Belt- it has to use the Spacelanes to cross No Man´s Land, or it is in serious risk of hitting an asteroid and being destroyed, due to its mass. Protection is 20,000/20,000. Speed, thrust, cruise and manueverability are low. Armament is 2 Pom-Pom turrets, 2 Medium damage laser/cannon forward, and 1 Extreme laser/cannon forward. Battleship: Battleships are terrifying vessels. They are armed primarily to destroy other Capships. Combined with fighter support and Pom-Poms, they are almost invulnerable. Protection is 40,000/40,000. Speed, thrust, cruise and manueverability are very low. Cannot enter Asteroid Belts without serious risk. Armament is 2 Pom-Pom turrets, 4 Extreme laser/cannon on turrets. BOTS Last but not least... bot support should be included. That´s easy enough that it hardly warrants additional comment, except that I think that random bot encounters should NEVER include Capships larger than Frigates. That would be bad. ************************************************************************************************ So, there it is... a basic game design document. I´d really like to make something like this work. Anybody else interested in making a multiplay mod that stresses teamwork, skill and the idea of constant combat?